Foundation Star Lee Pace Has An Interesting Theory About Cleon's Intellect

Apple TV's "Foundation" series is full of brilliant characters. Like, literally brilliant. Gaal Dornick (Lou Llobell) calms herself by reciting extremely long prime numbers. Hari Seldon (Jared Harris) is a mathematician who can use formulas to predict the future. Demerzel (Laura Birn) is a freaking robot. And then there's Emperor Cleon, aka Brother Day (Lee Pace). The cloned leader of the Galactic Empire may feel a bit off in a world full of geniuses, but Pace has his own theory behind the imperial overlord's intelligence. In an interview with Wired, he was asked about Cleon's unique, cloned but stunted cyclical life, to which the actor replied:

"I feel like what is true about Cleon is that he's got this instinct of, That's the right way. That's it. That's my opportunity. He puts himself in trouble in messy situations, and then he gets a hunch. I'm gonna follow that. He does, and most of the time it works out for him."

Pace pointed out that "Foundation" is a cerebral show that focuses on the strength of the mind, be it via mathematical genius or a telepathic power that feels like a Jedi mind trick. In the midst of this impressive mental acumen, Cleon stands out as a man of instinct. He can trust his gut when others follow their reason — and that leads him to one of the biggest moments of all, the revelation of the silent heroics of the trapped positronic robot Demerzel.

In his curious explanation of Brother Day's intellect, Lee Pace pointed out a couple of things that make Cleon the clone unique, especially in season 3. The first thing is that, despite his position at the top of the political pyramid, the man is a hot mess. Here's what Pace said:

"What I've unlocked, what I found to be really true about him, is that he's a mess. He's human and deeply flawed. He thought he was the hero of the story, but in reality there was another hero, and he was the bad guy and he didn't even consider it."

Being a bad guy when you didn't realize it can definitely mess with a person's mental state — especially when they're already dealing with the pressure of ruling over trillions of people across the galaxy. The other half of the Cleon coin is his nature. As a clone, Pace attributes some of Brother Day's accurate instincts to his literally copy-and-pasted pedigree:

"That goes back to the inherited nature of Cleon is that he gets this hunch of, I'm gonna get out of the palace, and I don't know what I'm going to find there, but I have a good feeling about it. [...] Although it's not rationality in any way, it's not logic, I do think it describes a kind of intelligence."

Pace added: "Maybe the truth is that it's in his DNA, it's written into that Cleonic DNA, even though he's never been taught it. You know, it's there, it's an instinct to dominate in a way, to come out on top."

Cleon may not be at the top of his math class. He might also be a hot mess. But the man is clearly an emperor, born and bred, and that's what Pace has tried to bring to the screen. His iteration of Cleon is a man who may lose his way at times, but he is never stupid. Pace summarized the character:

"He's not a dummy. He's toe-to-toe with these incredibly intelligent, cerebral minds — but he's got a very unique kind of cerebral mind, where he's not conscious of his intelligence."

He added that, while this is his approach to the cloned Cleon, it isn't the only interpretation. "I can give you my way of thinking about it," he said, "but it's certainly not the only way to think about it."

It's true, especially since Emperor Cleon I in Asimov's source material is very different from the one we see in the show. He's in the "Foundation" prequels, but is never cloned. Expanding his role is one of the major changes that has made Apple TV's "Foundation" a cleverly unique adaptation so far. We'll see if they can keep him in the mix moving forward now that the clones in storage have been wiped out. My guess is that they'll keep the surviving Cleons involved in some capacity, since the character has become so popular. Even if they don't, though, the writers have plenty of other Asimovian source material to work from heading into season 4.