Compare the trailer to this December’s Defiance to the trailer for October’s Valkyrie. Both begin with solemn white words on black referencing the evils of Adolf Hitler, but only the former manages to build up the palpable suspense and the grave importance of its character(s)’s mission. That is until a jarring tonal shift occurs at the fifty second mark, right when Defiance’s imagery should have intensified, stopped suddenly and left the audience wanting more. I went from curiosity, to slight intrigue to imagining one of Michael Scott’s feel good office posters. The title doesn’t help. Also, I have no idea what the $50 million budget went towards after watching this.
Directed by Edward Zwick (Blood Diamond, Glory, The Last Samurai), Defiance stars Daniel Craig, Jamie Bell and Liev Schreiber as three Jewish brothers who flee Nazi-occupied Poland and build a makeshift village alongside Russian resistance fighters.
You can also watch the trailer in High Definition at Yahoo.com. Defiance hits theaters on December 26, 2008.
January 18th, 2008 at 7:42 am
Wooh!
Last Samurai was great, Blood Diamond thrilling and goatgripping
A movie, made out of a story I’ve never heard anything of.
Is it based on true events?
Daniel Craig is super, Jamie Bell is a good actor and Liev Schreibers Accent is excellent.
Damn, i wanna see it.
January 18th, 2008 at 8:23 am
Daniel Craig is a superb offer…This look like a thrilling, suspenseful movie…I’ve enjoyed watching his movies since Layer Cake
January 18th, 2008 at 8:26 am
Movie based on Defiance by Nechama Tec. Also The Bielski Brothers by Peter Duffy.
These three brothers provided security for 1230 Jews who walked out of the forest after WWII. To survive they were ruthless, brutal to the Germans and their collaborators but always humane to the friendlies
January 18th, 2008 at 9:00 am
Dude, that looks legit, I don’t know what you’re bummin about.
January 18th, 2008 at 10:52 am
This movie looks amazing! I can’t wait to see it!! I read the documentary and the story is absolutely incredible!!! It’s hard to believe that such amazing heros exist in real life!
It’s about time someone made a movie about the Bielski Brothers!!
January 18th, 2008 at 2:30 pm
These Jewish partisan heroes were evil people. They plundered from local Polish and Belorussian villages to supply their own people. In doing so caused non Jewish villagers to starve and/or be executed by Germans for not providing the quotas of food and supplies from the shortages the partisans created. Not to mention, most of their “combat” operations were against unarmed civilians who they slaughtered on orders from their Soviet communist friends.
I guarantee you they won’t show all of their true actions in this movie. The Jews in Hollywood wouldn’t let that happen.
They could all burn in hell. I used to like Edward Zwick movies too, like Glory. I don’t think I’ll ever watch his films again, now.
January 18th, 2008 at 2:31 pm
http://www.starwon.com.au/~korey/Krzys%20Janiewicz/tuvia_bielski_and_his_partisans.htm
Forget to add this link
January 18th, 2008 at 3:57 pm
ed zewick incredible movie and story teller and this time he again captured on screen the modern day sparticus in three brothers the bielski brothers the trailer captures this amazing story in epic proporpion cant wait to share this movie experience
January 18th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
yay, Daniel Craig looks really good in the trailer.
January 19th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
quite looking forward to this. As with any story, the truth will be bended to make for more gripping viewing, just like the film U-571, just who did capture that enigma machine? lol.
Zachary, i wouldn’t get bogged down in facts about this, war is a cruel thing, and no one side is perfect. What is alarming is you think “They could all burn in hell.”, this is the kind of talk that isn’t needed on here, nor anywhere, as it’s slippery path to hate and violence. Just look what Hitler was able to do with this speech rallies, his hate is what corrupted a nation in believing what they were doing was justified. Every side did desperate things, in desperate times, it’s sad to say sometimes those things were not right.
January 20th, 2008 at 5:38 am
I am very moved just looking at the trailer. I had the unbelievable opportunity to live next door to this wonderful man(Tuvia Bielski) during my childhood years in NY. It is amazing that after so many years his story comes to life and will have an impact on all. This kind of heroism, courage, sanctity of life and bravery is something we can all learn from. May he and his brothers memories be blessed. I was so lucky to have known them.
January 20th, 2008 at 2:46 pm
Me and my family were fortunate to have survived the nazi
murderers.
We jumpet out of a train on the way to Maidanek death camp
and had there not been a Bielski Brigade all 12 of us would of not
survived.
January 21st, 2008 at 4:57 pm
I don’t know if your watching the same trailer. This thing BLOWS Valkyrie’s trailer out of the pond.
January 22nd, 2008 at 9:07 am
Hay Mike Stoll, give Zusia’s wife Sonia a call after all you went through together. There are no apoligies made by my father Zeus for killing anyone. It was a cold ruthless time and only the cold and the ruthless could thrive. A movie to inspire the Israeli govenment to be ruthless or the Holocaust will return. Here is a quote from Zeusia Bielski “they only understand the stick, otherwise they will kill you”. Shalom Moteks
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:21 pm
I just found out that this movie is about my college friend’s grandfather and I can’t wait to see it…it’s amazing that we all have connections to this one person and family, and I am proud to be Jewish among them!
January 23rd, 2008 at 7:26 am
Swiderski makes a hate speech against the Jews and you allow that???? Why????
January 23rd, 2008 at 5:53 pm
Look promising, we’ll see when it releases another trailer. Hope this movie is as good as Schindler’s List.
January 24th, 2008 at 9:18 pm
I am the grandaughter of Tuvia Bielski and for all of you already doubting the movie you should rethink what you posted because this movie is going to be sick. Let me ask you what Daniel Craig/Liev Shreiber/Jamie Belle/Alexa Davalos movie have you seen that wasn’t amazing. So stop basing your opinion on a 2 minute trailer. oh and has your grandfather saved 1200 people. I highly doubt that. Many people involved in the story are still present so watch what you say it’s offensive.
ps. look out for my brother as a 30 second extra sometime in the movie!
January 25th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
M/Sgt Berg
You name means mountain, it’s alway best to see the Swine-rski or other swine enemies from up top. This way you have a choices and the advantages of ignoring or scoring. Shalom
January 26th, 2008 at 11:16 am
Thanks Jay
I have been living in Israel for 38 years. Your words are so true if we do not wake up and stop always apologizing for our defense and our legitimate rights to be here we will fall. The world does not learn. You would think that after 9/11 the world would get a wake up call well it didn’t . The new Hitler is alive and kicking and when someone says they want to kill you believe them. I have always been inspired by your Uncle and my grandfather came from one of those little villages between the forests.There are no words absolutely no words to describe their heroism and even the movie will not tell it all but give the impression.I always said thank g-d I was not born at that time in history. Last week when President Bush was here he asked in Yad Vashem why the tracks to the camps were not bombed by the US army and i ask why did good old Uncle Sam not do anything? These great men did, they saved Jewish lives.
January 29th, 2008 at 10:44 pm
Please remove Swiderski’s hate speech. it is an ignorant insult to these heroic brothers.
January 30th, 2008 at 8:59 am
It is important to know and see that Swine-rski, Zackary by name, is alive and well smelling of kilbasa and thinking how to get the Yids. It’s better to know, see and smell those who have nothing, but for the hatred of us Yidalach. The Bielski brothers have taught us to see and smell Zack for what he is and not pretend he doesn’t exist. Ofcourse they also did the appropriate action when threatened.
January 30th, 2008 at 8:47 pm
I am awestruck, I cannot wait to see this movie. I am proud to say I have know Zeus and his family for many years, for his son married my cousin. If you were about to be exterminated just for being a jew, christian, gay or anything else, you would do ANYTHING to save as many lives as you could. There were no choices, kill or be killed. It was a different world back then.
Jay, your father and mother have alwas been an inspriation for me. I am proud to say I am related to a Bielski! Love you all (you know who you are, hope it’s a girl so I can play Barbies with a 4th generation Bielski)
Love you all - Lauren
January 31st, 2008 at 7:37 am
Hi Lauren-My whole point is that the ‘kill or be killed’ mentality is now absent from the Israeli gov’t. The Yids in Israel have the obligation to save as many Yidalach as possible by being ruthless instead of treading in the fire-water of the middle eastern snake states. Don’t forget the plastics on Tel Aviv windows that were supposed to protect against the scuds. When a skunk from Lebanon, a rat from Syria and the talking fecal matter in Iran say they want to kill us, and have killed us in the past, it’s the Bielski way or the highway to Africa, USA, Canada where we can build a false Jerusalem. Nice to hear from you spread the word on Defiance!
Can’t wait for the opening in Jerusalem. Shalom Moteks
February 1st, 2008 at 1:58 am
I will debate any Jew on any topic they claim is fact regarding Adolf Hitler and the holocaust.
The Jewish method of committing crimes is to portray themselves as the victim of the exact crime they are committing - duplicity aka double-think.
Public records prove that Jews were the criminals and deceived the world regarding Adolf Hitler. 73 Jews in Roosevelts government, and the main one being Henry Morgenthau Secretary of the Treasurey. Facts can’t be denied.
February 1st, 2008 at 10:17 am
People like Liberator (1:58 AM) are so enfused with hate for Jews, they, when they speak, are proof of the Holocaust. Where did all this animus toward Jews get directed? He (or she) is a modern day equivalent to the Polish anti-Semites. There are so many Holocaust Survivors who are still alive, and so many testimonies left from those who have passed away, so much history, so much film and documentation, and people like Liberator are content to gloss over it all. Just imagine, if someone like him was honest, wouldn’t they admit that Polish anti-Semitism was potent and a factor in Jewish Resistance. Then they could speak, and even be heard, by others as to Jewish ruthlessness. But they can’t be this honest and in their inability to even understand the need for honesty to be projected if they are to have an impact, they show they are capable of deceiving even themselves. So, they are like children pretending to be adults when the adults can easily see they are really just children.
February 5th, 2008 at 9:31 pm
swiderski you have some nerve.
February 6th, 2008 at 5:00 pm
Please watch the spellings; it is Swine-derski.
If it smells like a pork, wallows in pig stuff, snorts like a swine and speaks of Jews, it’s best shipped to the kilbasa factory, that is if it’s a lucky Swine and it’s eaten by other Fooles. Otherwise, in the time of the Bielskis, such Swine-derskis were used to fertilize the Polish ground. A year later delicious vegitables grew, and the Partisans ate them. Hay were those veggies kosher because of the fertilizer used? Gotta ask Rabbi Bielski. Don’t ignore you enemies use them. All City 1964 Midwood
February 6th, 2008 at 5:40 pm
Just a short comment for us Jews. Accept that others hate us enough to speak badly of us, gas, burn, shoot and nuke us.
The Shma Israel is all well and good for being at one with the creator’s universal consciousness. This movie and its portrayal of the Bielski historical event is about survival. My hope is that Israel will realize the diplomatic Bielskis were very ruthless. It is better to say the Shma when driving a sword through our enemies’ hearts. Now Mr. Zwick certainly understand this, you think he is expressing his Jewishness, and a wakeup for Israel’s survival, through the Bielski Partisans Defiance?
February 11th, 2008 at 9:59 pm
It is obvious to anyone that might have been saved by the bielski’s that the Bielskis are heroes not only to those that were saved but are heores of Humanity. Throughout Jewish history there have been many Jewish standouts (Heroes). Among these Jewry you will find the Bielsky family listed at the highest circle. The Bielsky brothers are recognized, and deservingly so, as the quintestial heroes of the diaspora. To see that these bothers are finally going to get the recognition they have so long deserved through this film is just outstanding and wonderful. The trailer is a primordial aspect of what is about to be fully shown on the screen. The whole world will catch a glimpse of a version of what it was like and what true heroes are , the Bielski brothers.
February 13th, 2008 at 4:00 pm
I do admire the Bielski brothers for what they did- not only saving 1200 but probably close to 6,000 if we would add their kid and grandkids.
War is a cruel and you have to do what you have done in order to survive. Only people who had survived the holocaust and their kids can understand it.
I was born in Poland after the war and I have met many “Swiderskis.We had left Poland.
For all the Jew haters- Do not blame the Jews blame Hitler and the German people for all the misery that came out of the war. Jews did not ask for that they were happy with their life. They did not ask to be send the labor and death camps.
My mom was from Lutsk (Volyn) among the 18,000 Jews killed was her mom and two sisters and a brother who were taken to the forest of “Polanka Hill” beaten by German –Einsatzkommand (murder operation) with the help of the Ukrainian police and shot thrown to the pits. My mom had survived only because she was in Siberia
My father had lost his first wife, two kids, mother sister and a brother and was in hiding in a barn belonged to a Polish farmer who had hidden two other people, he could not have them any longer since the neighbors became suspicious my father left and join the Russian partisan after he offered to sew new uniform to the commandant.
I wish my family had met the Bielski and I might have had grandparents’ uncles, aunts and cousins. God bless the Bielski.
February 14th, 2008 at 9:40 am
I still did not get a ruling on whether or not those delicious veggies that the partisans ate, as posted above were kosher even though they were fertilized with special poles.
February 15th, 2008 at 9:53 am
——————————————————————————–
——————————————————————————–I posted this in another section-but due to recent Middle East events this needs to be highlighted. I hope it’s ok with Zwick but if not that’s the Bielski way anyway.
I see Zwick as a political commentator and some of his movies like The Siege, Glory, Traffic and Blood Diamond are clear examples. If he can be manipulated into being himself, i.e., a warrior Jew, then the message of the politically savy and ruthless Bielskis is clear. It will come out in Defiance and it will be a huge hit in Israel. My prediction is that it will re-awaken the spirit of the 67 war. The Israeli government is so wishi-washi at this point in time. When Defiance comes out it will be a perfect convergence of culture and politics; between the timing of the Zwick film and the need for Israel to form alliances while being ruthless in the face of annihilation.
Now Zwick chose James Bond Bielski for a reason. That Defiance will not “sadly slip past their wandering eyes”. Everyone will want to see Craig and so see his full range of acting skills. The not so incidental message of the Bielskis is universal; fight oppression full force by saving your people first at all costs. Tuvia Bielski remark that he rather save one old Jewish woman than kill 10 Germans actually contributed to tens of thousands of Jewish offspring. Many of those have returned the favor and served in the Israeli Army. Even the bloodthirsty Zeus begrudgintly acknowledged his wisdom. He told me that if they weren’t a large group they would not have been able to form the various alliances that in large measure led to the survival. Most smaller groups were merged into gentile organizations, discriminated against, or simply killed if they remained small.
February 16th, 2008 at 9:16 pm
Both of my parents were with Tuvia and his brothers.
This movie is long overdue.
unfortunately much of my family did not survive the war.
Also this being Hollywood and the PC climate of today, the movie can not begin to tell the story of the Bielski Partisans.
I hope I’m wrong.
I,m only sorry that my dad is around to see it and make a judgement call.
February 17th, 2008 at 5:53 am
Hay Lebowitz don’t be so down your dad’s eyes are right above your own nose!
February 25th, 2008 at 9:55 pm
I am so proud of the Bielski Partisans…they saved my mothers life and I am here today (and so is my 82 year old mom ) because of their heroic acts of defiance. No matter how the public reacts to this film, they desire honor, respect and gratitude for the courage it took to save the lifes of so many. Thanks to all who are involved with bringing this story to life, again. It is so important for people to know that not everyone went quietly to their death.Those lucky enough to be among the Bielski Partisans were given the option to live. We all try to do the best with what we have, and with awareness ,intention and vision some of us even get to be amazing…I have heard the stories first hand and Tuvia Bielski was an amazing man. Thank you
February 28th, 2008 at 8:34 am
Jay—
When do you have time to feed your family when all you do is post on this site?
February 28th, 2008 at 9:38 am
hi Robert
sof sof, you said something I was wondering where you were…
shani
February 28th, 2008 at 10:51 am
He refuses to feed us, we are starving.
February 28th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
I get my veggies from behind bababony’s house in the night when they sleep. Meat I get from road kills that I collect and put in my trunk. Fish I get by throwing cherry bombs in the ponds. Fluids I get from my drains after good rains. All thes tricks were taught to me by those infamous Bielski groundhogs. Any other question refer to the mirror in your dugout bunker.
March 2nd, 2008 at 10:04 am
There is a G-d in heaven, and He looks after the Jewish People. Civilizations come and go, but WE WILL ALWAYS SURVIVE, NO MATTER WHAT.
These 3 brothers, along with Oskar Schindler, are part of the Lamed-Vavniks (the 36 righteous men that exist on the planet).
March 4th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
I just got word from a very short and bald Rabbi that the
good vegies that grew from the pole fertilizer were kosher
for eating by the Bielski partisans. He has a direct connect
to Elukim who told him that a Jew has an obligation to live
and survive at any cost. The answer also covers the qustion
of whether or not the Isralies can eat veggies after killing
and burying (for fertilzer)the militants. However note that
if the Israelies can get veggies by using other fertizers it
is best to bury the militants together with the guts of pigs.
In the case
that Israel does not have enough pigs to bury the militants
there is a case that wild boar innerds can be used. There is a
possibility that once the militants realize that they will lay with
pig or boar intestines (other parts can be used) and not lay with
72 virgins they may reconsider martyrdom. Don’t forget fellows
they want to kill us all just because we exist with humanity and
they as land crawlers. Until they are educated as to thier own
humanity they will only understand the stick.
March 4th, 2008 at 9:05 pm
This story was brought to life brilliantly in a book titled “The Bielski Brothers” by Peter Duffy. He goes into great detail. A fascinating read.
March 9th, 2008 at 1:15 pm
——————————————————————————–Here is my response to a typical anti-semetic Pole by the name of Yoshi-moron-1 from IMDB.com.
Like I said before there were many Poles who helped my family and their Jews to survive. There were many Poles who were not afraid to be discovered aiding Jews and thereby bringing death onto their families. Those, the unafraid, turned in Jews or killed them themselves. Those were the ones the Bielskies killed, including thier families and burned down thier houses. And yes-seri Yoshi-moron-1 they burned down thier villages if the first lesson didn’t through the Kilbasa wrapping (skull). After a few months the Kilbasas got the message and turned in the Jews to the Bielskies.
The Home Army used Jews, unarmed, or armed and overmatched, as target practice as directed by the head Kilbasa. The Naiboki masscare was a result and a living surviver, who you so eloquantly belittled, said most of the killing was done by the Russians.
Now what is the present lesson to us Jews. Well those Arabushes who through suicide kill Jews; their Arab families, intergenerasionally i.e., grand parents, parents, brothers, sisters and thier children, need to feel the finality that their offspring have wrought. And following the Bielski precedence, if that lesson isn’t learned then the entire block where the martyr house is situated needs to be burned to the ground.
As for the rockets using Jews like the Home Army, first the building closest to the launch site is leveled, the second rocket will bring forth the total destruction of that particular block.
I previously wrote that I have no animosity toward you, the Poles, the Arabs nor the rest of the anti-semitic citizens of the world. But we will be strong and able to deal with you and your kind at the first attempt to act upon your self destructive impulses. Look to yourselves why you hate others and remember I Love Your Pain until you give it up! Carry on Shmuck.
All-City 1964/USMC/IDF
March 18th, 2008 at 1:15 pm
—-
DEFIANCE… DELIVERS
There will be tears… There will be cheers…
Mostly though, DEFIANCE is an expertly crafted, beautifully acted drama set inside… a good old fashioned action movie. Complete with compelling and complex heroes played by Daniel Craig (Tuvia), Liev Schreiber (Zus) and Jamie Bell (Asael), DEFIANCE grips you from the first frame and doesn’t let go.
Directed by Ed Zwick, DEFIANCE is the fascinating true story about three Jewish brothers who escape into the Belarussian forest to survive when Jews were being massacred by the thousands during the Nazi invasion of Poland. The brothers don’t just hide. They don’t just survive. They fight. They save 1,200 other Jews in the process, all of whom form a community in the middle of the woods that provides freedom, hope and a base of operation for missions against the Nazis. I can’t believe I’d never heard about this story or these amazing, courageous people before.
I don’t wish to give up the whole plot here because action movies rely on audiences not knowing every move before it happens on screen. So I don’t plan on providing a lot of detail here but here’s what stood out for me: The film’s opening sequence takes what appears to be real footage circa 1941 of Jews bring viciously rounded up for slaughter and seamlessly blends from black and white pictures with a scratchy, ancient look about them to the shiny, colorful grandness of cinematographer, Eduardo Serra’s luscious framework. The segue is particularly effective because it starts the film off with the reminder that we’re about to witness something that is based on true events, but lets us know that we’ll be seeing it with Zwick and company’s signature look and feel of his best filmmaking efforts. It doesn’t disappoint.
Daniel Craig is the moral center of the film, but as mentioned in paragraph one, these are complex men. Don’t expect “good guys fight bad guys†and call it a day. While Craig’s character is the leader, he also experiences moments of weakness, allowing other characters reveal their strengths in those moments. I was really impressed by Craig in this movie. I’ve always thought of him as a “fluffy†actor but with DEFIANCE, he proves himself as a serious dramatic force. Liev Schreiber, who is consistently good in every role he tackles, really pulls out all the stops with “Zus.†This is Schreiber’s coming out party as a bonafide movie star. And Jamie Bell is all grown up and kicking some serious thespian ass in the film. Nice to see little Billy Elliott sinking his teeth into a meaty role. The stunning Alexa Davalos (where has this girl been?) is a find. The entire ensemble is terrific down to the smallest role.
From the direction, editing, cinematography, costumes to the production design and incredibly realistic sound, DEFIANCE is simply beautiful to watch. And I’m glad that it didn’t travel the traditional Holocaust drama road, but emerged as something very different and quite satisfying. Despite tackling some pretty difficult subject matter and dealing with intense situations, unbelievably, the film is not depressing but rather… Inspiring… It’s just an old-fashioned crowd pleaser.
April 5th, 2008 at 12:51 pm
You can read about the Bielskis here and their murder of 128 civilians.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naliboki_massacre
Belskee, you idiot, the home army set up the Zegota, which saved countless Jewish lives. It participated in the Warsaw Ghetto uprising. It sent Witold Pilecki to Auschwitz to document the mass murder and sent the courier Jan Karski to England and the US to alert the allies. If youre gonna post lies, please post your red army sources so people can see through them.
Esti,
“For all the Jew haters- Do not blame the Jews blame Hitler and the German people for all the misery that came out of the war.”
I know this isnt directed at me ;) but I will answer anyway.
Considering, Hitler and Stalin invaded Poland together, and split the country among themselves, I think laying the blame solely on Hitler and his collaborators in unfair. Stalin was just was big of a mass murderer as Hitler and the Bielskis were no better than Nazi collaborators for aiding him. One cannot simply look only at the good a person does. Im sure there was ample opportunity for the Germans during WW2 to save german civilians who regarded them as heros for doing so but thats only half the story.
April 5th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
Here is a link to an article about Witold Pilecki, who volunteered to be sent to Auschwitz to document what was going on there.
I hope Im not being a rabid antisemite if I add that after the war he was sentenced to death by a Jewish judge who is alive today in London as well as by from testimony from Jewish-communists who lied and said he as a Nazi collaborator. Im guessing you’ll never hear that story from hollywood.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/12/14/6305/5500
April 16th, 2008 at 7:49 pm
Alex, Alexander the great paid homage to the Jews because he undersood that we got the singularity. You have taken the position that we do not thank the Poles that did all they could to help to save our humanity. This is not correct. The various examples of Poles that tried to help fellow humans, who happen to be Jews, is not forgotten. I only remind you that other Poles relished in killing Jews, taking their property and rejoiced in thier genocide. It’s no big deal to you, but to the Bielskis, there was, and is, a time to retirubtion. If you think the Naliboki event was significant you may consider the Iranian threats to be of a similar condition. Understand this, my fellow human, never again.
April 20th, 2008 at 4:32 pm
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1034303/board/flat/88101708?d=latest&p=10#latest
Short and concise presentation of what the Bielskis gave to jewmanity and thereby humanity, see accomplishments of Jews since WWII.
May 17th, 2008 at 8:33 am
Daniel Craig … mmm …
June 2nd, 2008 at 1:43 pm
I recently had the pleasure of seeing Liev playing someone that I knew all my life in the Defiance Bielski Partisans movie done by the super Ed Zwick. He hit the very core of the character who was Zus Bielski. I don’t know how he did it but he found it within himself to be as warm and as cold as Zus was. Zus was warm, he liked to sing and hug and dance. Zus was cold, he killed without compassion, with a cold steal look and sometimes a smirk. Thank Liev
June 4th, 2008 at 9:14 am
this looks like the movie of the year!
cant wait to see it!
June 16th, 2008 at 2:40 am
the film has only a little to do with the history…
Bielski partisans were terririzing villagers living around and were stealing their food, clothes and animals ….
on 8th of May 1943 they killed 128 innocent people in NALIBOKI town…
June 17th, 2008 at 8:03 am
Zachary - Thank you. Except for the burn in hell part. You do speak the truth. This is Hollywood and it is sad that they would promote these men as heros. (Thanks Boho) The 8th of May 1943 they killed 128 innocent people in NALIBOKI town. I am so sad that people just blindly trust Hollywood. These men were basically on Stalins side. Was Stalin much different than Hitler? There are so many true stories that cross borders and show truth. Really, I think Poland suffered more than any country in World War II and it should be given its due. Poland fought and fought and fought and there are many Polish heros which should be given their due. As Boho pointed out - here is one http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/12/14/6305/5500
and some more info. again.
http://www.starwon.com.au/~korey/Krzys%20Janiewicz/tuvia_bielski_and_his_partisans.htm
June 17th, 2008 at 10:43 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Righteous_Among_the_Nations
Naliboki village was armed and turned in Jews to be butchers and butchered themselves.
Poland has the most Righteous, agreed. This does not change the many Polish and Bellarussian people who butchered Jews. They did so for Jew’s property, possessions,rewards by the vermine Nazies and their collaborators and it was fueled by the simple centuries old hatred and uninhibited greed. That six thousand and more Polish people helped the Jews out of 38 or so million people 6 thousand are Righteous and assume 4 more thousand helped and were not properly recognized. That makes it 10 thousand of 38 million people which comes out to 2.6%, hardly a majority of morality living there. The continued denial by present day Polish people just means that the hatred continues just underneath but morality is now the politically correct position.
See the movie it does not portray the Polish people in a negative light whatssoever. On the contrary it focuses on the 2.6 percent of the Righteous, bless their souls.
June 17th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
It was a very difficulit time, only the strong could survive, do you think that the peasants would voluntary give away their food? The Bielski did everything possible to survive.
· Yes its true that Poland has the most Righteous but they had most of the Jewish population in Eroupe.3,5 million Jews, where 3 million had perished . Netherland had 85% of their Jews 106,000 who did perish during the war but the Dutch people do not fall far away from the Polish Righteous I believe that they are about 4600 Dutch people on the list and 6000 Polish.
·
· They were a lot of Hooligans who robbed, black mailed and killed Jews. They were some peasants that did hide Jews and did scarified their life to save others but they were many who did turn Jews in for a few kilos of sugar or Vodka.
· The Polish nation had two enemies the German and the Russian when the Jews saw only the German as enemy, its not that they “loved “the Russian but could “get a long better” with some extra food, vodka and fur.
· Many Jews from middle class were deported to Siberia too, until today the Poles are still saying that the Jews were communist, nor Bieliski were communist or Capitalist they were simple people who wanted to survive. They should rest in peace.
June 19th, 2008 at 1:58 pm
Esti, interesting double standard. Bileski brothers and their band stole and killed poor peasants while enjoying protection of the Soviets to survive. While Polish civilians of course stole and killed Jews out of greed. Survivor did not have anything to do with that, after all war for the Poles was just a walk in the park; the times were only difficult for the Jews. The truth is Bielskis had enough food, actually they had so much of it that they supplied Soviet commissars with it. Moreover, they were Polish citizens, aiding and abetting the enemy, they simply were traitors. Also for Dutch German occupation was not what it was for the Poles, so comparing the two is simply dishonest. Germans were much more brutal in Poland, as many Poles end up in concentration camps, were forcibly relocated, executions of civilians were common, and hundred of thousands has been sent to forced labor in Germany. Meanwhile about 40000 Dutch volunteered to Waffen-SS.
June 19th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
temblino-boho you are as ignorant as they come. You are not only lacking in knowledge of history, but also lack simple math skills. How could 10k of 38mil be 2.6% when 1% is 380k? Another aspect of your post is also incorrect. You forgetting that Poland was a multiethnic country then, with 30% of minorities, out of which about 9% were Jews. So out of 35mil (not 38mil, see the link below) there was only 24.5mil Poles. Also the country was split between Germany and Soviet Union in 1939. A lot of people were escaping from the German occupied section when Soviets moved in. So how many Poles were left in German occupied section? Let say 50% as western parts of Poland were more densely populated. That’s 12.25mil. Now let’s say 10% was displaced during the war (concentration camps, executed, forced labor, etc.), that leaves us with 11milion. Out of that lets take out elderly and children, is 30% ok? So we are left with 7.7mil of mostly terrorized population that was looking to survive the whole ordeal. There also was more then 10k people helping the Jews, you forgetting about Zegota which had about 200,000 members. Now, do those numbers satisfy you or that still is not enough? May be Poles during the war should forget about their families and the country and do nothing but help Jews. May be then you would stop spewing lies about them?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BBegota
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Polish_Republic
June 19th, 2008 at 11:24 pm
Dear All,
Although everyone has a right to their opinions the bottom line is this was a ruthless war, the name of the game was survival under the most abnormal situations, no logic, no reasons no excuses. Neither of us were there. You can read and do all the statistics you want but the 6million were murdered and not saved due to the “neighborly” relations of the Poles as mentioned above, not to mention after the war how the good “neighbors”acted to the Jewish survivors. So basically
stop with this defending of the Poles. Yes there were many innocent people killed but when you are at war you get caught in the crossfire. I live it everyday. Remember when someone wants to kill you they mean it !
June 20th, 2008 at 12:02 am
Bielski brothers wasn’t any heros. They even didn’t fight with the Nazi. They just sat in the forest and tried to survived. From time to time when they didn’t have anything to eat they attacted and plundered neighbouring villages. They taken everything shoes, food, horses and catle. It is obvious that peasants defented they property. Not only because the Bileski brothers was the communists suporter but also because the peasants didn’t have much themself and they were starving. in the Village Naliboki Bielski brothers killed more than 128 people man , woman and children. The move is maybe great, but it is not a historical movie.
June 20th, 2008 at 10:29 am
Yes veryrosey1@hotmail.com statistic do not matter, nor do the facts it’s only the crap in your head that’s important. 6 million were murdered out of which 3 million were Poles. Out of 3 million Jews many were from Hungary, France, Italy and other parts of Europe why don’t you blame them, they were neighbors of Jews as well. The bottom line is they all were murdered by Germans, but by some weird twist of logic the blame seems to be directed at Poles alone. Get this, Poles had no responsibility, nor were required to save a single Jew, yet many of them did, sometimes at the peril of their own families.
June 20th, 2008 at 11:51 am
I think that main problem is that it happened on Polish soil and there is lot of guilt going around that some Poles who did help- but not enough many described them as passive standbys. Churches did very little to encourage people to help Jews.
I find that the Hungarian were bad too especially the Arrow Cross but since they had started to deported Jews in Hungary in the summer of 1944, by that time some Jews were saved by that time the German were losing the war.
Jews were haunted like dogs; you are wonder why the Polish Jews had helped the Russian partisans? They were the only ones that accept Jews and not all of them Bielski were the only one that accepted women, old and kids.
If you read the book about the Bielski it was obviously hard to figure out whom to trust, even with the Russian they had to “act” so they would leave them alone. Tovia was a very good politician and knew how to negotiate and that what saved the 1200 Jews.
They did not have enough food but they were very resourceful and started to open shops and did exchange services with the Russian –food/medical care- for weapon.
White Polish partisans hated Jews as much as they hated German.
I never could understand growing up in Poland as a child why we were so hated by the Poles? I know that it was a lot of propaganda seeing Jews as enemy and outsider.
Poles did believe that German would do the same to the Poles as they did to the Jews but they had run of the time.
I know that Poles were treated very harsh but how can you explain the people who consider themselves as victims started to victimize other? Why were the pogroms after the WWll? Why people who did save Jews were afraid to revel it?
June 21st, 2008 at 3:21 pm
Kielbasas smell the same if you put them in the alter of Rome, Polania, Bellarussian, Russia, England, Parisia, America, or any other nation that resents the Jews for having a the gonads to be individuals in relation to the universal. Einstein said it first.
June 22nd, 2008 at 3:34 pm
So when the bielskis murder hundreds of civilians for allegedly supporting the nazis (by allowing them to steal their food) its all about survival and tough times so its excusable.
But when Poles murder Jews for as revenge for allegedly supporting the soviets in their campiagn of murder and rape in Jedwabne, its not excusable and Poles are as bad as nazis.
I condemn both of these atrocities.
Defiance is as disgusting a movie as one glorifying the heroes of Jedwabne for defeating the red menace in a barn.
June 23rd, 2008 at 7:47 am
by Cherrybrook77 2 days ago (Fri Jun 20 2008 09:37:09)
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Now I’m no pundit, just a lowly Associate Professor of history, but I have to say that seeing the new Daniel Craig movie, DEFIANCE, was truly an extraordinary experience. I’m usually pretty skeptical of a film’s ability to do justice to history, but this was not only an honest evocation of an important overlooked event, it was also a moving, exciting and hugely powerful piece of dramatic storytelling. Several times during the two hours I found my eyes welling with emotion, and by the end I was surprised to feel so uplifted, inspired even, by its life-affirming message. I had liked Daniel Craig as the new James Bond and felt that he had real ability as an actor but I had no idea of the depth and soulfulness of his range. And Liev Schreiber was overpowering as his volatile brother. Also, Jamie Bell’s coming-of-age at the end of the story was one of its most affecting moments. Don’t know the lead actress’s name but she was very strong as well, not to mention hauntingly beautiful.
I don’t know how these things end up being decided, but all I can say is I will be incredulous if this movie isn’t among the nominees at year’s end. It’s simply everything a movie should be: great story, great acting, great action, and a fresh look at one of the most important stories of our time
Long live the Bielski legacy!
July 14th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
This is certainly a true story. It is well documented. There are a variety of eyewitness accounts. I have a good friend (age 96) whose sister was there.
I don’t know anything about the movie, and people who make movies have a tendency to embellish or tinker with facts for the purpose of “art” but in essence, the story is quite true.