“I have arrived to destroy your Internetz!”
We’ve held off on posting about the gargantuan Terminator 4 spoiler that hit AICN yesterday because it just seemed so ‘tarded. Then again, this is a PG-13 Terminator with a subtitle that belongs on a Madonna biography, so anything can happen. ;) Well, CHUD has connected the dots based on their own inside info and the verdict is that the ending/mega-spoiler may very well be legit. In their words, AICN just kicked McG’s film (the new first in a new trilogy) “in the balls.” Need I say that everything below this point is glowing radioactive with SPOILERS so do not read if you think your exoskeleton will melt.
Discuss: Please let us know what you think, you daring spoiler-seekers. Do you still have doubts (about the spoiler’s authenticity)? If it is indeed legit, do you feel this twist is a zany dealbreaker, because I do?
Here’s the original spoiler…
“Alright so the main character is a cyborg named Marcus. For some background, Marcus was a criminal who was executed in 2003. He donated his body to Project Angel which was involved with SkyNet. They take his body and make a terminator out of him so he’s a terminator skeleton but has living muscle/skin and a beating heart too. At the end of the movie John Connor is fighting a T800 model 101 and loses. He dies and the top resistance people come up with a plan to help the resistance keep fighting on. The resistance feels that it’s important to keep the image or idea that John Connor is still alive so the resistance keeps going. So they rip off Marcus’ skin and put John Connor’s on the skeleton so now Marcus is John Connor.”
Like I said, this post is dipped in spoiler substance, and no, it’s not safe to continue reading. Okay, so I liked Face/Off for what it was, but, if true, this is just too much. Devin at CHUD checked with numerous sources and came back with this…
“The rest of AICN/Mori’s spoiler - about the fate of Christian Bale’s John Connor - is stuff that I cannot confirm as solidly as Marcus the cyborg, but is what I had come to believe after talking to multiple sources. You may remember that I ran with the story that Bale would be playing a Terminator… well, I was sort of right. The confusion arose from the fact that by the end of the film, Connor is dead and Marcus, the cyborg Terminator, is impersonating him. “
There’s the possibility that the spoiler originates from an earlier draft, but if not, CHUD says “it’s on the money.” More on this as it develops.
Discuss: Please let us know what you think. Do you still have doubts? If it is indeed legit, do you feel this twist is a smelly dealbreaker, because I do?
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:14 am
Sounds like a good idea to start a trilogy with, but if this is the biggest story plot that happens in the first film then it is a shame but they need to have more in it.
Get Idea
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:18 am
Please explain why you think its a smelly dealbreaker? I think a John Conner cyborg was inevitable. This can make for future action packed fight scenes with cyborg vs cyborg… hero vs villain.
But… questions arise…. if John Conner is in fact dead, how did his skin get placed on Marcus? And why is Marcus now ‘good’ if he was evil before? Did Marcus die too so the resistance could place John Conner’s skin on him? Or did they use Marcus’ cyborg parts to make the real John Conner (brain, heart, and all) still alive?
Spoiler or not… its a good plot. I’m tired of fancy boy happy endings with no originality. Maybe if you can explain to me why a human John Conner is better than a fake cyborg John Conner, then we can debate this.
But… I think it’s AWESOME!
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:21 am
NO, NO, NO, NO, NO!!!!!!!!!!!
NO MORE SPOILERS!
I REFUSE TO READ!
“Spit it out, Dr. Jones! Iz bad! Iz bad!”
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:23 am
Look, I’m a HUGE Terminator fan. But please just f–king stop with the sequels. I’m so sick of it all.
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:27 am
I really do wish i never read this spoiler on AICN to begin with but I think the idea of ‘the spirit of John Connor’ leading humanity isn’t THAT horrible. Since the spoiler leaked, I feel its overrepresented for the film as a whole; probably due to it being revealed in isolation. I’d like to think, and really really hope, that its only the hook for the first film and that they got much more installed for us.
Also, I always found it weird that Bale was announced as taking part in the whole trilogy before Sam Worthington who is supposed to plays the trilogy’s protagonist Marcus. I just assumed it was because Bale was the drawcard for the trilogy but it all makes sense now.
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:32 am
>>AB
agreed.
i still haven’t seen T3 and don’t plan to. and after reading the spoiler, chances are i won’t be seeing this one either.
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:33 am
I’m not sure why this is surprising since this is what the T-850 revealsed to John Connor in T3: that Skynet sent a T-800 (the model that he had a connection to in T2) to go and kill him, which apparently doesn’t sink in by T4.
While this whole plotline does sound interesting, it really kills what people have been waiting to see all along: an older, battle scarred John Connor leading the resistance, fighting within an inch of his life each day. The producers probably thought seeing John Connor fighting for 3 movies would be boring and that they needed to kill him in order to give the movie more depth, which is certainly needed for a trilogy.
While I don’t have that much of a problem with the ending, I really am a bit disappointed that Connor still gets killed after being warned by the T-850. There better be a damn well written scene where it’s believable enough that Connor, despite being warned, is killed in a way he does not expect; such as getting the best of the T-800 thanks to the warning only to get taken down by a secret weapon hidden within the T-800.
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:36 am
I think this could be a very interesting twist on the Terminator mythos. Is also puts a lot more emphasis on the commanders under Connor which could be very cool. My one problem….doesn’t that mean that all the other movies to save John Connor are a bust? Will they go into that in the other movies? That the missions to save Connor were just for show, or a ruse? Why do they so the cyborg thing at all? Why not go back in time 10 mins and save him? I am not sold this is true, but it would take some clever writing to make this even half plausible…
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:43 am
I think it would work better if Connor was critically injured and saved by technology gained from Marcus.
If Connor dies it really cheapens T1/T2 I feel. Terminator is more of Connor’s story than the machine’s story I feel.
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:49 am
Got damn internet.
June 3rd, 2008 at 9:53 am
the story don’t work.
because John Connor sends Kyle Reese back to save his mum, and makes him memorize them words…only the real John Connor would know.and apparently this movie is before he sends Kyle Reese back.
no brainer this sucks ass and lets not forget this dude made charlies angels 2! do we really want him f-king with this beloved series?
June 3rd, 2008 at 10:05 am
“My one problem….doesn’t that mean that all the other movies to save John Connor are a bust?”
No, because what was important in T1 and T2 was that John Connor would actually exist to lead in the future. He’s there to establish a legacy, since after all, he’s human and will die sooner or later. Once the resistance has a Che Guevara-like figure for the humans to look up to for generations to come, the storyline in T4 is certainly plausible without hurting T1 and T2.
June 3rd, 2008 at 10:11 am
This plot, if true, sounds too sci-fi cheesy. I’m already disgruntled
about this film and this possible plot spoiler doesn’t give me
any more hope that the movie will turn out good.
June 3rd, 2008 at 10:19 am
Weak. As long as Brolin is the villain we rock and roll.
June 3rd, 2008 at 10:50 am
Yeah, killing the core character of the whole series really gives it more “depth”. How about giving it more depth by you know… giving it more depth. Instead they resort to insane gimmicks. This is a Midichloridian level fuck up and sounds like an idea from a direct to video knock-off.
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:00 am
Even I think this is stupid!
Copyrite Microsoft 2029
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:08 am
‘tarded
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:12 am
Wow, what the F__k did I just read?
This is (if true) the worst idea I have ever heard in my life!!!!! I can’t even believe this, its soo assinine. Man I can’t get over how stupid this is.
I’m not even going to type the obvious logic problems with the ripping of the skin and such. Insane. If this is true wow what a dumb concept.
John Connor was the leader of the resistance because he had the experience to deal with Terminators that mankind didn’t. (He wasn’t used for moral or to lift the spirits of his resistance soldiers.)
He was the only one that new Terminators would send in infiltration models and that it would take allmost. 25 years before this would occur. Skynet didn’t start building human looking cyborgs till way after Judgement Day.
Man this is soooo messsed up.
Its clear (now) that when Mario Kassar sold the rights to the Terminator franchise he made a really bad choice for the fans.
I can’t fricken believe this, unfricken real……!!!!!
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:26 am
Well, another beloved franchise receives the proverbial stake through the heart. Not that T3 was that great but at least I could try to forget that it ever happened now that I knew John Connor would be kicking some titanium dome in the new trilogy. I for one thank the guys at AICN and here at /film for posting this… prevented me from actually expecting something out of this mess. The only thing i see saving this now is the performances (and they better be killer).
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:27 am
Oh yeah, and yes… this is indeed a “big, smelly deal-breaker” to me at least.
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:29 am
it is important to the very foundation of the terminator mythos, that connor is a human, who leads the human race to resurrection/victory.
first we have to deal with the fact that he’s a secondary character, and now he’s a goddamn robot?!?!
i said on other posts i’d hold my pessimism, but like hunter said, this bullshit - if its true - is a dealbreaker.
no matter how cool it looks, or how many big names they have, or how many special effects they throw in: if the STORY is faulted it will all come crashing down. if an idiot like me can figure that out, why can’t these guys?
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:32 am
The continuity and coolness of the first two movies is ruined already. Why sweat it now?
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:35 am
btw you guys: the sarah connor chronicles turned out to be an amazing tv show. i highly recomend it. (not that i’m a super-reliable source, i just think that terminator fans - if they get past the first few episodes - will see that it’s really fucking good)
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:35 am
4. This happens
5. The resistance finds out this happened and get pissed.
6. It turns out this didn’t really happen but was just to keep Connor safe.
… what a twist!
I dunno, it could possibly turn out to be sort of decent if they happen to maybe do it well enough.
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:38 am
@ a little more than useless
Thanks for the extra armor, dude, although from the looks of things in the comments, we won’t need it. ;)
June 3rd, 2008 at 12:05 pm
MIGHT EXPLAIN HOW CONNOR GETS THE HUGH JASS SCAR ON HIS FACE-LOOK AT THE START OF T2…HE’S ALL RUGGEDLY F’D UP.
June 3rd, 2008 at 12:16 pm
I don’t like this at all, what was the point of the other three movies to keep John Connor alive, only to have him die in the fourth, before the trilogy is even over. I’d like to see a future warrior John Connor kicking some Terminator ass, and eventually finding a way to bring SkyNet down. None of this convoluted John Connor not the main character, cyborg, dying bullshit.
June 3rd, 2008 at 12:32 pm
This is a mistake of monumental proportions.
June 3rd, 2008 at 12:36 pm
The worst thing about Terminator 3 and now Terminator 4 is how much they invalidate the events of the first two movies.
June 3rd, 2008 at 1:08 pm
And so the birth of a new Vader is witnessed where our hero becomes more machine than man in a world where he should be more man than machine…killing machines to save mankind…because, well because nobody really knows why….
June 3rd, 2008 at 1:08 pm
F@£KING IDIOTS!!!!!!
June 3rd, 2008 at 1:33 pm
why make this in a TERMINATOR movie it would work in another movie itself? but The terminator sequels all suck *well only 3, because they ruin the point of the originals
June 3rd, 2008 at 2:26 pm
This site should completely stay away from stuff like this. What if the rumor is right and this is the ending? It’s certainly not as ‘off the wall’ bad as AICN advertised it, or at least it certainly depends on how it is written. Certainly not too far afield for the genre. I mean, what do people want, more of T3? The Sarah Connor Chronicles? Why not see a new story? And, frankly, leave it to fan-boys to revile this story while embracing boomer-waste-product Ridley Scott’s obnoxious final cut of Blade Runner. But my point to this site is more essential; let AICN spoil things because they suck, but don’t dwell there yourselves.
June 3rd, 2008 at 3:31 pm
Well if you thought the final cut of Blade Runner sucked that explains why you like this concept.
Thanks /film for saving me 10 bucks on seeing this BS Terminator plot.
June 3rd, 2008 at 8:01 pm
There can only be one ending to this new trilogy that would make me drool:
Regardless of what happens in between, the third movie MUST end with John Connor sending Kyle Reese back in time to save Sarah Connor. They need to set it up so that the story loops back to the beginning where we can watch Terminator 1 right after Terminator 6, and it follows continuity. THAT would be an EPIC SERIES! anyone else agree?
June 3rd, 2008 at 8:11 pm
Yeah TK, I agree but by then who’s gonna care if John Connor is a Terminator from 2003 (the Angel project)?
My Gawd that’s just the lamest thing I have ever heard today!
June 3rd, 2008 at 10:19 pm
Really? You guys want it to end that way? I’d kinda like to see what happens in the future after Kyle gets sent back….but maybe that’s just me.
June 3rd, 2008 at 10:27 pm
I’d like to see the human John Connor take out the Time Machine…………..
And or reset or restore the timeline for humans.
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:24 pm
Send a Terminator back in time and assassinate MCG’s mother before she gives birth to him.
June 3rd, 2008 at 11:51 pm
Capt. Awesome!,
If McG goes down this dead Conner, future Terminator Salvation route I’m gonna be very pissed off.
You hear me McG MTFKR?!?!!!
790
June 4th, 2008 at 6:13 pm
Well the movie wont be released for another year. Here’s hoping the staff of the movie sees how pissed the fans are and realizes what a gigantic mistake this ‘twist’ ending is, and does reshoots to keep Connor alive.
June 8th, 2008 at 11:38 am
Its great allegory. This is where we are heading anyway. I think it is disturbing on a subconscious level to most because the idea that computers will lead us to the singularity is too freaky. Though most scientists say it is inevitable. Many think we will see this in our lifetime.
June 20th, 2008 at 11:48 pm
i dont belive this. one it sounds like an awsome idea, but what the hell was the point in the first 3 movies. to save a persons skin so they can stick it on a terminator? sounds fake to me but if it is true it would be a really stupid thing to do.
June 25th, 2008 at 9:41 pm
I think the ending has potential to be something great but as many have pointed out why save him in three movies just to kill him doesn’t seem right.
if they are going to go ahead with this ending are they going to bring him back say the resistance fake his death create this cyborg look alike while the real john is working in secret?
or has john got a son who is going to carry on his work?
i personally think they will ruin the famous terminator by killing the whole point of these movies john conner and his resistance
July 4th, 2008 at 9:12 am
Sounds cool,
I’m up for it.
July 16th, 2008 at 4:07 pm
i’ll never understand why you guys want to ruin the moviegoing experience by posting these kinds of massive spoilers. I can understand little things, but the ending of a movie?! Very lame.
July 21st, 2008 at 3:46 pm
The teaser trailer kicked ass. I can’t wait for the movie. I don’t care what its about, just as long as there are 1) robots, 2) Joh Connor, 3) more robots , 4) robots/terminators we haven’t seen before but the BOOK says so much about (not to mention the old old arcade game that shows all of the many different robots like snakes and momma-skynet).
Yall can say what you want… let the movie come out first, then get a rope and string up that McG if it sucks… (since we all know how those other movies he’s done really really suck). But I’ll give him a chance with kick-ass Christian Bale in his corner.
July 25th, 2008 at 9:28 am
I won’t give any merit to rumors anymore, all they do is skew perception. Don’t buy it until you see it for yourself.
There is no fate but what we make for ourselves.
Find Home Plate.
July 28th, 2008 at 1:28 pm
Isn’t this exactly what the studios want? To release “misinformation” to confuse the real story? I think it’s bullshit, and falls exactly along the lines of creating viral marketing through ridiculous “spoilers” getting leaked. Hell, this way, FanBoys and Haters all get exactly what they want!
I’m still going to see the fuck out this movie. :)
August 3rd, 2008 at 12:43 pm
All the 3 Terminator movies were about John Connor.
But isn’t John Connor himself the result of a paradox ?….
He’d never be born if Kyle Reese wasnt sent back to the past.
But John sent Kyle !
So did Kyle Reese protect John, or create John ?
What if Kyle Reese is killed before he is sent into the past ?
The whole paradox better have some solid explanation !
August 3rd, 2008 at 11:54 pm
John Connor and SNYNET are both their own creators. It’s one of those time paradox things that some movies have embedded in their core source material. Like back to the future, there are a lot of theoretical impossibilities and improbabilities. But according to movie lore, SKYNET sent a terminator back in time to eliminate John before he was born, John sent a soldier to make sure he was conceived and born. It turns out Kyle Reese is John Connor’s father and the Terminator was reverse engineered by Cyberdyne and gave birth to it’s core processor. Time paradox, I don’t know if it can be explained, but every time there’s a terminator movie, the first thing they state is that the future was altered… There’s a big freaking clue why.
August 4th, 2008 at 12:12 am
DN27888, yeah I agree, in basic time travel 101, the universal timeline is split in a alternate seperate multiverse the second Reese is sent to 1984. (But its a movie remember your not supposed to out-think a movie based on quantum mechanics in real time, shit eveyone knows that) lol
Just pretend that we are stuck in that multiverse with Skynet and deal with it. ;-)
My bitch is that Connor should be going after one target above even sending Reese back to 1984. The target is the Skynet Time Machine. With the destruction of that along with Connors sacrifice he could theoretically restore the timeline and prevent Skynet and everything along with it.
August 5th, 2008 at 10:16 am
New Poster Kicks Ass!!
http://rss.warnerbros.com/terminatorsalvation/terminatorsalvation-comic-c.jpg
What’s funny, is that the blown up 7-Eleven almost looks like the same gas station Sarah Connor had that picture of her taken by some little mexican kid. “What’d he just say?” “He said there’s a storm coming”… “I know kid…. i know…”
I no give you 5 american dollars!! I give you whipping myself! Now scram!
August 6th, 2008 at 11:07 am
I dont care what story they wrap around Teminator: Salvation… I just want to see some butt kicking action from the resistance in the judegement day war that previous movies have been glimpsing at.
August 22nd, 2008 at 6:08 pm
Well, if you consider that Dark Knight’s Jonah Nolan has arrived to sort out the script, i reckon this has real promise.
If this is the ‘ending’, so what - Marcus is the product of a Skynet side-project, infusing robotics with human bodily organs. It’s obvious skynet is trying to make its machines more human - look at the T800 endoskeleton! Why wouldnt they try fusing human minds into their machines?
And then the film concludes, Connor is ‘dying’, but the only way to save him is to rebuild his body with some cybernetic parts. Connor is forced to become what he has grown up to hate - part machine.
When you put it that way, it could really work.
August 22nd, 2008 at 7:13 pm
DanHallUk,,, I really hope they don’t go down that road. They need to focus on Skynet, the Time Machine, Kyle Reese and the war. Of course Connor would be the lead character.
If they turn this franchise into some kind of Connor Frankenstien I’m getting a refund !!!
Keep in mind Connor survies the war in all the other films,,, having him die and become a robot is the worst idea I have ever heard.
If the producers are going there, this film will fail , I have no doubt.
August 25th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
okay i wish i wouldn’t have read it. this sucks how are you just going to kill off john conner he is the human not machine that leads the humans to deffeat the machines. basically your saying that the other movies were full of crap. I like the idea of seeing him scared and beat up fighting the machines. and what about his kids that they talk about in t3. if he is a machine how does he have kids. im sorry but we have been led to beleive over all these years that a man named john conner defeats the machines not another machine. and if he dies who is going to tell resse about his mother so he can find her in the past. last time i checked john conner in t2 he was scared and was human.
August 25th, 2008 at 2:14 pm
I could see maybe he gets really hurt and they need terminator parts to make him live. but not making him into a terminator. but i agree with tk i would like to see them send reese back through time. I love who is playing conner Bale will do a great job. but if you make conner into a terminator its going to kill what the franchise has stood for.
August 25th, 2008 at 2:18 pm
i have to agree with 790 he is right.
August 25th, 2008 at 5:53 pm
@Ssmazey, I’m worried that if they taxidermy Connor what else are they gonna ruin ??
In the trailers we see this Harvester, (some kind of transformer size robot that scoops ppl up, wtf, is that?)
I’m watching every thread on T4 in anticipation and fear.
August 26th, 2008 at 1:54 pm
im the same way 790 i tried looking more stuff on it but i couldnt find anything. and i dont beleive that crap that Mcg saying only three people know the ending. I heard somebody today say that conner would be a bad a** if he was a machine i thought they were stupid. cause conner should already be a bad a** cause he is really the only one that knows how to destoy them. and i have a question does anybody know if tech com is going to use their plasma rifles cause thats the ionly thing i thought besides bombs or missiles that can kill a terminator?
August 26th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
Ssmazey,,,,, did you hear that Johnathan Nolan has been on the set since that rumor came out,,, rewriting the script? Holly crap !!!! (This dosnt look good). And recently is seems the production dropped the “The Future Begins” from the title.
(I think there reading /Film and ScreenRant). Lol,,,
As far as I know the Resistance takes the plasma rifles off the dead Terminators. /?/
After the war the humans had nothing. Connor was the one that organised the remenants of the military using the underground network of underground bases. We see this happen at the end of T3,,,
Yeah anyone that thinks Connor would be a cool robot, is kinda wacked (IMO).
August 27th, 2008 at 8:38 am
wow… have you guys even read the novel from the first movie? or even the second novel frome T2? We’re talking about more machines than any of the previous other movies even touched on. Of course there’re harvestors and other types of machines in the Skynet arsenal. And never does it say that John Connor survived until the end of the war. He need only survive until he sends Kyle Reese back. It does talk of his mother dying in South America though, through the radio chatter. And he cries in a back room while his other Commanders wait outside. I do think that if they are going to create an ending to John Connor, this could be a way to do it. Alot of you seem like you’re younger folks who never really got into the spirit of the original movie. It was dark, scary, full of things that no human could imagine in the future. But it was there. The original board drawings for the second movie even had scenes that would have given more detail about the different types of machines Skynet created on its OWN. Who could ever say what a computer would create not based on human definitions, which the humans had in mind when first creating the machines at Cyberdyne based on the arm and computer chip found. I for one am so disappointed in T3 that I can’t even voice it. It all ended when Arnold put them damn star-shaped sunglasses on and also says ‘talk to the hand’… now what the hell was that? I want to see a movie about the Terminators running it all. Its their world in the future, not mankind’s. So I expect to see some pretty scary things based on the processors of the momma-Skynet. She wants to destroy all LIFE, so you need some very menacing things to accomplish that against a vermin-like race known as humans that just won’t die. I can’t wait for this film. Been waiting since the mid 80’s for the REAL Judgement Day to come. But we’ve only been fed teaspoons of what happens in the future. These new movies should give a FULL account of what happens, which was never covered in any of the previous movies or in the novels or in the TV series (which is so lame and kiddy-fied). This movie should make James Cameron feel honored that someone could stand up and create what his mind had once envisioned. I applaud the new Director and Writers for the work they are doing, especially if they keep the Theme of the movie as close to the original non-comedic performance of the first legendary film. Sarah Connor was a laymen turned soldier in a matter of days, not only dodging death, but giving a death-blow to a machine bent on murder. Mankind of the future should be facing the same circumstances when confronted with obliteration: unknowing victims becoming die-hard soldiers to survive, no matter the cost. And if that cost is to turn the most renowned warrior of the future into a machine so that he can continue on, then so be it. That will just make it harder for the machines to kill another machine.
August 27th, 2008 at 10:08 am
Arramon,, yep I’ve read both novels and I saw both films in the theatre when they came out.
Arramon, do you remember the humorous back story on Dr Silberman,,, (if you read the novels you will know what I’m talking about)
While the novels did come up with alot of back stories for the minor characters, I don’t rememeber anything on the Harvesters. I remember the T-400’s and the T-600’s that was all the novels covered. The machines didn’t need the harvesters because most of the humans were too weak to resist.
I do remember some of the drawings, there was a Silverfish looking robot that hugged the ground, and also a huge spider looking cyborg that was dubbed the T-10.000.
But NEVER,,, was there a concept of a huge walking Cyborg Harvester that scooped ppl up.
And if you recall Connor DID survive the war because the war ended when they stormed Skynet and found the Time Displacement tech. If you follow T1, this is all explained by Reese. He goes onto say that THEY WON , SKYNET was takin out, once he was sent back they blew the place.
You would rather have an ending where Connor dies and becomes some type of new. machine ??? Not me.
If anything the next film should show how Skynet cranks out the machines way after the war. (Not retro with some BS Marcus character), and the Time machine should be Connors main target.
I’m all for giving a FULL account of what happens after JD, but to embelish the franchise with harvesters and a T-Connor sounds lame and comedic.
From what I’m seeing so far, expect to be let down ,,,,,, Arramon.
August 27th, 2008 at 4:29 pm
I watch the movies first before I judge them. And like I said, I expect there to be many many more machines created by Skynet that the novels or movies never mentioned. What Kyle Reese explained was from what HE knew. Not from what was the actual products from Skynet used across the entire globe. The war was faught on all continents, by all nations. Kyle Reese was at one point in the future part of the work teams assigned to put dead humans into furnaces since Skynet was trying to destroy all humankind, so the machines used in the effort to capture humans that weren’t a part of the Tech-Com resistance group, that John Connor was General of, could have more than likely been machines designed to do just that: harvest the ones that were hard to find.
“McG suggested that the Harvesters will apparently play a prominent, Matrix-like role, gigantic machines that are ’stomping through the future, harvesting people.’”
There are also other novels as well written by SM Stirling: T2 Infiltrator, T2 Rising Storm and T2 Future War, plus some by Blackford and Tiedermann. These talk about other terminator models and machines, plus other characters and machines that went back in time.
In Stirling’s novels, John Connor was killed by a T-850 series terminator (an upgraded version of the T-800 designed to withstand Plasma rifles) on July 4th, 2032, when Connor allowed it to enter the Resistance compound, inwhich is easily disposed of almost the entire resistance leaders. But that contradicted the T3 novel that says John was there to send the T-850 terminator back in time to fight the T-X.
Other models: T-1, T-70, T-600, T-101/800/850, T-888, T-1000, T-1000000, T-X, and the Cameron Phillips Infiltrator (in the TV series). The I series machines were Infiltrators who were originally human with cyborg parts added to their bodies as needed. They were babies coaxed to grow in certain ways, and were not detectable by dogs. The T-Meg (T-1,000,000) was supposed to be a bunch of T-1000’s that melded together to form the giant spider terminator, and was used to protect Skynet.
People are mostly familiar with only the T-800, T-1000, T-850 and T-X models from the movies, although Franco Columbo played one of the different T-800 robots, Model 102 (as Arnold was model 101), in a future flashback by Kyle Reese, when he was hiding out in the underground sections, and the Terminators came blasting in after the watch dogs went crazy. I wonder if the new movie will have the color wristbands that let the Tech-Coms know how to spot Terminators, since the color was changed periodically. The Centipedes (Silverfish) were in the video game. Those were a pain to destroy. =b
This movie will take place in 2018, long before the Arnold terminator was developed (T-800). The machines that will make an appearance are: Hydrobot (Silverfish design for water), T-1 Unit, Aerostat (that scan the lands from above), Harvesters (to find humans), Mototerminator, Classic Aerial Hunter-Killer, Transport (for humans caught by harvesters), Ground Hunter-Killer, T-600.
“Given the complex, interweaving, and conflicting timelines in the collective Terminator films and The Sarah Connor Chronicles, McG has opted not to adhere too strictly to the mythology established in these works, but has worked on maintaining the vision of the first films, Cameron’s in particular.”
August 27th, 2008 at 5:06 pm
Arramon,,, I see you are a huge fan,,,, nice info on your post !!! :-)
Yeah I agree about watching the film first before totally trashing it. Lol.
Personally I kinda have a vision of what I expect to see in a T4 film and this isn’t it , exactly. But I’ll just have to wait and see.
Also thanks for reminding me about Stirlings novels. I totally forgot those.
Yeah I read the first 2.
I remember we find out that “Hitlers Mine Komhp book” was loaded into Skynet and that was one reason the computer killed mankind.
Those books took some huge liberties but were a fun read. I remember one of the characters was a stunt man who looked like the Swarzennger 101. And also there was a verbal command that Connor used on one T-850 to cause it to reboot itself. Awesome stuff !!
August 28th, 2008 at 10:59 am
I just think the second and third movies had their chance of telling the story of the Future War, but they never followed through. So that kind of leaves it open game to any who wants to fill in the missing pieces of that time period. And since James Cameron is giving his own two cents worth of info to the director and writers about what he would do for certain aspects of the film, I’m hoping a Cameron-like overtone captures the theme of the movie. All of James Cameron’s movies were always drenched in certain tones that gave a good visual style for the movie being watched.
Love Aliens and the Abyss tones, which T2 had as well. All rich with color. Cameron always used ambient lighting well. This new movie is gonna be saturated with a different type of tone the farther on it goes, more colorless and grunge with the colors of life being exterminated and destroyed, a visual style that will go well with the colorless mechanical machines that begin to rule the planet.
And is there a movie that Christian Bale can’t act well in???? Empire of the Sun, American Psycho, Reign of Fire, Equilibrium, Rescue Dawn, new Batman 1&2, the Prestige, and now this Terminator! All hail Bale. The man can act, and if he brings even an ounce of that talent to the new T movies… sweet jeebus.
And since its going to be a 3-movie production, there’s room for improvement on each installment. On the fly script edits are a good choice while in production, especially if the writers and director are taking note of technical discrepencies or Terminator lore that fans or other Terminator enthusiasts (or the creator himself) bring to their attention. New machine creations for the second and third films would be awesome… maybe even a T-Meg in the 3rd film. Or even a T-Infinity, which can relocate itself to other time periods at any moment, and can translocate direct hits from weapons so it won’t be destroyed. Wonder if the animal-bots will make an appearance. Skynet studied many animals like rats to create these smaller infiltrating robots to help find out information about human strongholds and possibly their next moves.
The T-800 series (Arnold) also had many other offshoots without the skin but with the same upper chassis and using smaller treads similar to that of the HK tanks and carried more explosive arms and had sniper programming. These were used to go places the larger HK tanks couldn’t.
If I’m drawn into the movie as much as I think I’ll be, having a cliffhanger ending of a movie based on if John Connor will become part cyborg or not, I won’t be so dissapointed if he does if the movie itself lives up to the Future War we’ve all wanted to see happen.
August 28th, 2008 at 12:23 pm
okay arramon i see you are a big fan so am i. i have aslo watched these films since i was a kid and read the books and played the games. your saying conner being turned into a terminator is a good thing!!! well your wrong. thats really stupid to say that it goes back to what i said earlier why make the previous films saving conner if he is just going to die in the first installment of the new triliogy. If he dies he should die in the very last film or something. and last time i checked in t3 arnold says that his kids get have a big part in the war as well remember that. plus he has to live to tell resse about his mom last time i checked a stupid terminator named marcus doesnt have his memmories. i mean i could see his arm getting blown off or something and they replace it with a terminator arm but dont kill him off its stupid and it would be suicide for the other films. and i do agree with you that Bale is a great actor i have most of his films but it has to have a great story to be a great film. and plus this is before the t 800 101 model was even created and resse said it showed up towards when he went backmin time. well from what i have read online is that something happens and the t101 arnold which isent being played by arnold shows upmat the end of the film. plus I dont trust Mcg they didnt even film for very long. cameron took a long time filming t2 to be perfect and it was. i really and really hope im wrong and that its going to be great but it wont with that ending.
August 28th, 2008 at 4:23 pm
I’m with Ssmazey,,, if they taxidermy Connor I’m walking out for a refund !!!!!
August 28th, 2008 at 5:08 pm
I agree with 790 i better get my refund. and i really hope Mcg is reading all of these cause if kills conner there is going to be some pissed off people and im one of them. this is what i don’t understand about Mcg. He says he wants to stay with the other movies but if he kills off conner how is conner going to have kids?
August 28th, 2008 at 5:22 pm
okay guys i heard a never spoiler just now. it turns out that john conner isen’t even the main character. Iv read that the main character is marcus. And that there are terminators that are half human and of their brain is a neural net proccesser so that skynet can control them.
August 28th, 2008 at 5:22 pm
sorry i meant new spoiler not never.
August 28th, 2008 at 5:39 pm
Yeah the rumors just get worse Ssmazey. Dosnt that concept sound like the Borg on Star Trek? Stupid Stupid Stupid !!!
Aarramon
The prob I have with this entire direction is that their turning a simple yet perfect action future war story, into a 3 ring Circus , meaning 3 films that really only needs to be one good one.
I’ve always thought of Connor in a way like Captain Kilgore (Robert Duvall) from Apocalypes Now, he’s right out there on the lines and he never gets a scratch. He allready knows he survives the war , he’s unstoppable. That’s one reason Skynet trys to kill him before he turns into a bad ass military leader !!!!!!!!
Killing Connor will be the biggest mistake in cinema history. Forget nuking the fridge.
August 28th, 2008 at 6:20 pm
T4, should be about the final days of the last offensive on Skynet. It should start out kinda like in (saving private ryan) just 28 minutes of intense machine on human warfare. At the end of the battle you could see the last scene that’s in T2, where Connor walks down that hallway and out to the landing where he picks up the bi-nocks, ooks thru them and then bammm!!!!!
TERMINATOR 4, WAR ACCROSS TIME
The Credits ,,,,,,,,,,,the Music !!!!!!!!!!
Then we go right back to the battle where we see Connor meeting with Reese. Throughout the entire film, Connor allways looks at Reese a little different then the rest. Ironically Connor takes him under his wing like a son (Timetravel will fuck with your mind) ,and teachs him all he knows about Skynet. The rest of the film would be like a WW2 epic, with John Connor racing against time to destroy the Time machine.
He figures that the last chance he has to stop Judgment Day is to prevent Skynet from sendng anything back to the past. You could write it out like a war against time literaly. The film could have alot of nail bitting tension. And in the end something goes wrong and we see him having to send Reese, uncle bob, and T3 back to the past.
The techs are in a serious hurry reprogramming the endos and something goes wrong with 2nd one.
Ending 01,
It flips out and shoots Connor before they can shut it down and reprogram it. Leaving the ending in a cliffhanger with Connors heath in question for a sequel, as the bullet dosnt kill him instantly.
Ending 02,
The 2nd Terminator’s programming is reset by Katherine Brewster as a way to make John never trust a model 101. She’s also pregnant and in a weird way programs the 101 to tell John that. (Just something a women/mom would do). The actress playing Brewster would have to play a strong female lead in T4, in some ways she would be more badass than Sarah.
They could even put in a Robert Patrick cameo. He could be one of Connors top guys. During the fighting he’s taken prisoner, and then later becomes the template for an experimental model called the T-1000.
How cool would that be!!! He’s great as a soldier on The Unit !!!!
(Anyway rant over),,,,,
they could do alot of cool stuff, all I’m saying is the crap I’m hearing sounds real stupid and careless.
August 29th, 2008 at 8:58 am
t-800 and t-1000 haven’t been created in this time period… it pretty much takes off after T2 a few years down the road (2018) so the stuff from the previous two main movies haven’t occured or been created by skynet yet. and i don’t think they will make john connor a robot terminator like everyone is thinking. i think perhaps just have some ‘borg-like’ implants.
it can go a few ways with these possibilities. connor can have these implants, he can have his skin grafted onto a certain terminator skeleton and his memories transferred, or have a more robotic frame work infused… etc etc. At the beginning of the teaser, it specifically states that this isnt the future john’s mother had told her about. something was different.. the timelines seem to have taken longer for things to occur. the world isn’t so destroyed by the looks of the trailer for the year 2018, so the downward spiral must have drawn on for some time before the story of T4 kicks in. the destruction of cyberdyne in part 2 could have stalled the skynet advancement upon humans. they will have the Infiltrators, the slimmer models that the original terminator sent back to kill sarah was supposed to be (which Biehn would have done), so Connor could have some connection between cybernetics and implants if he falls.
you also can’t stick with detailed timeline events in a world that allows for event on any timeline to be altered from the past. you then have you Back to the Future skews that appear. things change, new things can occur, other things can not.
i kind of feel that if the creator of Terminator had a problem with the direction of the new movie was going, he’d say something… James Cameron is almost OCD perfect when it comes to projects he’s involved with (as all his Special edition movies give evidence to this). its a leap and bound to use a director normally known for cheezy chick action flicks, but if he wants to change the way inwhich people view his filming styles, this is one way to do it.
it also isn’t written in stone that what people think is going to happen will happen… in the production or in the reality of the movie. =b
we’re talking new ground peeps. a new playground for people to express a view on a world devistated by machines. this movie isn’t even near the scenes we’ve seen in flashbacks of the future. it’s the buildup. remember, McG is taking off after T2, not T3. So the discussions of John’s children or whatnot could be lost to the skewing of time.
Based on movies 1 and 2, it only states that Connor lead the resistance to the Skynet stronghold and broke beyond its barriers to the main core of the central ‘mother’ mainframe. we see Connor as a seasoned general with battle wounds. where did those come from? was that a normal Connor at that point? if it weren’t, do you think it would have been common knowledge to the people fighting machines that their leader fell and was reborn somehow using cyborg mechanics, and that they’d all understand? things could have been hidden to help secure the resistance’s future so it wouldn’t fall apart at the seems if Connor fell and never got back up even before they breeched the Skynet compound. but what we see in the flashbacks would happen in the other movies yet to be filmed. we’re being given a view of the time when Connor is trying to survive the early years just after the nuclear bombardment a decade earlier.
it could also be true that by the time it does get to the period that the earlier movies showed that the harvesters and other bots of this movie won’t exist or could be replaced by better and newer creations from skynet more resembling the machines we know from the years around 2025-2029 when the Tech-Com groups start taking control of more arsenals of the machines, capture more robots and turn them, and start using skynets creations against itself.
and since Connor isn’t the major leader at this point in time, it shouldnt surprise anyone if Connor is upstaged by another character already locked within the cyberdyne world by being its own creation: marcus. this could be a person that actually teaches connor the things that help him survive much longer and in the process show him things about the machine/human connections and possibilities that can occur from infusions or implantations.
skynet is building its army, the humans are trying to find some means of uniting and becoming some sort of movement against their new oppressors, and infiltrators are being sent out to find the yet to be leader, while gathering as many humans as possible for whatever reasons (labor, extermination, who knows at this point).
its almost as if these could be prequels leading up to the terminators and humans being sent back to the past to save Sarah Connor in the very last movie, years after this movie takes place. maybe about 10 years between this movie and the third.
August 29th, 2008 at 10:58 am
Interesting thoughts Aarramon,,,,
Sounds more like a bad horror movie than a future war sci-fi film.
The first thing you mentioned was that the T-800 hasn’t been invented yet. Rumor has it that Marcus is a T-800 from 2004.
Borg inplants, do you really think the Terminator fans are gonna dig that???
If MCG skips past T3, then this isn’t a Terminator move. I don’t quite understand why some ppl wish T3 never happened.
Cyberdyne was bought out and taken underground by the Military. (Where’s the problem with that). This in turn leads to Skynet taking over. This was all mentioned by Terminator in T2. T3 followed Terminator canon, now you want to throw that all away and make some retarded cyborg orgy with skin graphs. I suppose Ciders Sini Hospital survied the nuclear fallout???
NO THANKS,,,,,,,
I enjoy reading your post, but if they take your direction Aarramon, Terminator is over. I won’t wait 10 years to see that ending. (IMO) the fans will hate it as well…..
August 29th, 2008 at 1:43 pm
try #3 to post this…
Few things:
Marcus is a proto-type T-600 created by humans.. not the same T-600’s created by Skynet almost a decade later.
McG already stated that Warner Bros deliberately releases misinformation to keep people from the truth before the movie comes out. This entire thread could be opposite of what happens.
http://www.moviesonline.ca/movienews_15296.html
“The continuity in the Terminator films was always a little flexible and no one really minds because they’re such wonderful stories. T2 is 10 years later and John looks like he’s 13. What’s your take on the timeline when this starts?
MCG: Well there’s no doubt that at the beginning of T3, for example, begins with a bit of a punt as to what happened at the end of T2, and there’s some rejuggling of the timelines. We’re largely treating it as though the bombs have gone off. I’m not going to share with you what the date is when the bombs go off, and we come into the picture in 2018.”
T3 could have definitely happened, but it may not include things that the movie stated, since the timelines reflected are more geared towards how the original movies were laid out.
“We’ve done the best we can to honor the timelines that have been put into place and I think it ultimately feels very satisfying. If we’ve done our job properly, then this will be regarded as the statement of the time and the place and the where and the when and the why and the how. And it comes from a place of doing a lot of research with, you know, futurists, with scientists who talk about how long it would take the atmosphere to clear itself out so you could actually go back outside and do your thing.
We’re trying to just sort of amalgamate the three pictures and amalgamate the intention, and then answer that to the best of our ability. Again, there are certain things that are in stone. The T800 comes in 2029, you know. We’re building towards that place. Therefore, if hardware should show up in 2018 that was supposed to be around in 2029, that’s a problem for John Connor.”
Who’s to say Skynet didn’t send machines into the future instead of just the past?
What we may think from this so-called spoiler could be way off from the truth. McG has also said that the name Salvation comes from the fact that one of the characters will make a sacrifice to save something/someone. This could also mean that Marcus sacrifices himself (a robot) to save humans (since one falls in love with him), or Marcus could sacrifice himself to save Connor or Reese. Doesn’t mean that Connor will sacrifice himself and become a machine so the resistance will continue on. It’s all speculation.
August 29th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
attempt #4 to post this… =b
Few things:
Marcus is a proto-type T-600 created by humans.. not the same T-600’s created by Skynet almost a decade later.
McG already stated that Warner Bros deliberately releases misinformation to keep people from the truth before the movie comes out. This entire thread could be opposite of what happens.
http://www.moviesonline.ca/movienews_15296.html
“The continuity in the Terminator films was always a little flexible and no one really minds because they’re such wonderful stories. T2 is 10 years later and John looks like he’s 13. What’s your take on the timeline when this starts?
MCG: Well there’s no doubt that at the beginning of T3, for example, begins with a bit of a punt as to what happened at the end of T2, and there’s some rejuggling of the timelines. We’re largely treating it as though the bombs have gone off. I’m not going to share with you what the date is when the bombs go off, and we come into the picture in 2018.”
T3 could have definitely happened, but it may not include things that the movie stated, since the timelines reflected are more geared towards how the original movies were laid out.
“We’ve done the best we can to honor the timelines that have been put into place and I think it ultimately feels very satisfying. If we’ve done our job properly, then this will be regarded as the statement of the time and the place and the where and the when and the why and the how. And it comes from a place of doing a lot of research with, you know, futurists, with scientists who talk about how long it would take the atmosphere to clear itself out so you could actually go back outside and do your thing.
We’re trying to just sort of amalgamate the three pictures and amalgamate the intention, and then answer that to the best of our ability. Again, there are certain things that are in stone. The T800 comes in 2029, you know. We’re building towards that place. Therefore, if hardware should show up in 2018 that was supposed to be around in 2029, that’s a problem for John Connor.”
Who’s to say Skynet didn’t send machines into the future instead of just the past?
What we may think from this so-called spoiler could be way off from the truth. McG has also said that the name Salvation comes from the fact that one of the characters will make a sacrifice to save something/someone. This could also mean that Marcus sacrifices himself (a robot) to save humans (since one falls in love with him), or Marcus could sacrifice himself to save Connor or Reese. Doesn’t mean that Connor will sacrifice himself and become a machine so the resistance will continue on. It’s all speculation.
I am also a fan just like everyone else so the direction the creators go in is based on input not only from the orignal creator but from alot of other staff from the first movies, not from me. And, as being a fan, I don’t see myself hating it. Its like looking at the old Batmans (with Keaton, Kilmer, etc) and comparing it to the new Batman. No comparison. What this movie will hopefully do is plunge the viewer into the world of the future ruled by machines that the viewer has only dreamt of (through visions of flashbacks and a few seconds within the intros of all movies).
August 29th, 2008 at 2:35 pm
wow… talk about duplication… =b
LOL
August 29th, 2008 at 3:11 pm
Having humans build a T-600 is laughable.
Why would they name it a T-600. The “T” stands for Terminator ya know.
Cyberdyne dosnt exist after T2,,, its all military. Remember they were perfecting the T-01 at the time.
I’ve seen Marcus and his skin dosnt look rubber ???
Connors age never came up and it hardlly matters at this point.
MCG states that alot of info could be dis-info,,, does that include all the stuff on his blog,,, ????
I believe that when these rumors came out, the backlash was so harsh that MCG got worried and started all this spin, hired Nolan to basically rewrite the shitty script they all thought was awesome.
Having a human fall in love with Marcus is just more awefull thinking and direction.
If you watch carefully there’s a scene in T3, where the Terminator updates his internal clock,,, it rewinds itself from 2029 to 2004.
2004 is when Judgement day happened.
We don’t know for sure the T-800’s came out in 2029. Very well could have been 2026. We only hear Reese mention that they were new and harder to spot because they had real skin.
In the comics Skynet did in fact send Terminators back in time more than once as tests to perfect the time machine.
Having Skynet use the Time machine to send Terminators all over time, seems stupid and dives far away from the core story.
I’m NOT looking forward to all these lame concepts MCG thinks are so awesome. Every single piece of info I hear on T4 gets worse and worse.
I will not support this film if it sucks, and so far based on what I see , its sucking hard !!!!!
MCG really must be as stupid as ppl say because some of his thoughts on the Terminator franchise sound incredibly horrible, and really dumb.
If these rumors are half true he’s gonna make alot of enemies out of Terminator fans.
August 29th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
maybe just you..
August 30th, 2008 at 7:30 pm
790 is right Arramon. you arent making any since your trying to say three never hapeend then why the hell is kate even in the da*n movie then. your not making any sine. 790 has a perfect story thats what they should do instead of making all these different machines like the harvester. last time i checked reese basically said that t 600s were the ones that imprisoned them and that human were on brink of extinction then a man not machine broke them out and tought them how to smash them mother fuc*ers into junk. That was out of kyle reeses mouth himself.
August 30th, 2008 at 11:12 pm
Thanks Ssmazey,,,,!
Glad you liked my version. :-)
September 3rd, 2008 at 7:42 am
done commenting in here with fools who can’t even wait for the movie to come out before bashing it. Yall make no sense… even less than this supposed ending from this thread. Get real and let the creators do what they’re doing before the movie comes out. I never said Part 3 didn’t exist dolts.
Kids make me laugh.
September 3rd, 2008 at 8:29 am
last from me:
http://www.horror-movies.ca/horror_12697.html
“Terminator Salvation is on hold after Helena Bonham’s family members were killed in a bus accident in Africa. From Filmonic comes the following;
The actresses cousin Fiona Bonham Carter, 51, escaped with a broken shoulder. But Fiona’s son Marcus Egerton-Warburton, 14, her mother Brenda, 74, and stepfather Francis Kirkwood, 75, all died.
Fiona’s sister-in-law Kay Boardman, 54, also perished in the crash, in a remote area six hours’ drive from Johannesburg. Bonham Carter has now been granted indefinite leave from the set of Terminator Salvation in Albuquerque, New Mexico to fly back to the U.K. to comfort her distraught family.
Tragic News. I am sure shooting will commence soon once they find a way to work around Helena’s absence.”
R.I.P. Bonham family